OK, please tell me if you guys think I'm just some nut. [OK, well, that's a given I guess but I mean in this specific instance....;) ]
We bought the Sonlight Core 3/4 to use with our 9yo daughter. It is for grades 3 and 4 basically. [She is 4th this year]. Sonlight is amazingly expensive, and we are using Seton for all the academics [Sonlight for the reading, history, and science], so it was definitely a tremendous investment for us. We really liked the idea of "literature based learning" though that Sonlight has, and we felt it was worth it at the time.
I am *so* frustrated with Sonlight. [we already started our year because we are expecting a baby in Sept]. The first issue I had was that the Instructor's Guides were a nightmare and I think they are terrible - better off with no "lesson plans" than these mixed up things that are a nightmare to try to wade through [and often page numbers are wrong - not carefully done IMO].
Now, I'm VERY concerned about the books they've sent. I've been reading some of her books ahead of time and some of them have been awesome! [Like "Caddie Woodlawn" - I can't believe I never read that book before - it was wonderful! LOL!]
But I'm feeling concerned about a couple of the other choices in her Core - I read "Cheaper by the Dozen" last week [because I've always wanted to read it and never did!], and I was very concerned about some of the things in that book - the father's rabid anti-Christian attitude, the multiple instances of "Taking the Lord's Name in Vain" and a several swear words as well as the last two chapters where the older daughters become teenagers and basically disobey the father and kind of ridicule his rules and wheedle him in to changing his mind [about things like dressing modestly]. I was very uncomfortable with that - these aren't really lessons I want my 9yo to learn [or any of my kids no matter the age actually....].
Then, this week I read "Turn Homeward, Hannalee" and, while it is an *excellent* book that I really enjoyed, I felt it was totally inappropriate for a 9yo.... specifically the scene in the first half of the book where the Yankee soldiers get scary drunk and try to basically rape the young Confederate mill worker girls - while it doesn't say "rape" in the book, what happens is a VERY intense scene and it is obvious to me as an adult what is happening and I think it might be scary and confusing for my daughter, who does NOT know "all" the details about the facts of life yet. The other scene that I really thought was way too intense for a 9yo was the scene near the end where the two kids witness the battle of Murfreesboro TN and see the slaughter that happens - which is shared in some gruesome detail [such as the young heroine almost throwing up when she stumbles upon a dead soldier whose face is gone and there is "only blood where his face should be"]. Again, while it was an amazing story, it was *extremely* intense throughout.... totally too intense for the age group IMO - it was an intense read for *me* as an adult!
Now I feel really worried -I'm not sure I'm going to have time to proofread ALL her core before she gets to the books and I'm worried about what some of the content is in the other books. So far I've read 4 of them and 2 of them have been inappropriate in my opinion for a child my daughter's age. [If she were 15 I would not hesitate to let her read "Turn Homeward, Hannalee" - still don't think I'd let her read "Cheaper by the dozen" though.]
I thought maybe I was being overprotective, but I discussed it with my husband and he agreed also that these are not what we would consider appropriate for this age group.
So, now I feel like I spent this INSANE amount of money on a curriculum that is causing me extreme amounts of work [proofreading all 40 books or so that she's supposed to read this year AND the lesson plans are awful]. And, it looks like half the books I paid for will be books I don't want her to read...
I posted on the Sonlight Catholic list asking about this [basically wondering if I just picked the two "bad" books to read or if this problem ran through the whole core and asking how other families handled this] and I'm getting practically flamed!!!! EVERYONE who has responded has said I am pretty much a naive idiot and that my children are "going to learn about this stuff sooner or later so it might as well be now".
REALLY? WHY does a 9yo need to read about rape and gore on the battlefield? WHY should I expose a 9yo to curse words and taking the name of the Lord in vain? And why should I let her read a book that glamorizes teenage daughters who disobey and disrespect their parents and basically act like, um.... "Ho"s..... LOL!
I don't get it. I really feel like if I wanted to expose her to all this at such a young age, I might as well just enroll her in public school -which I can do for FREE and without paying Sonlight $900 to corrupt her for me and at considerably less effort on my part....
Am I totally off base here? Are there any other parents out there who would object to this content for a *9* year old? [That's the thing - some of this stuff would be GREAT on a high school level or even an older middle school level - but NINE?!!! Come on....]
Ugh. Now I'm feeling both frustrated and like a total freak. [not for the first or last time I bet LOL!]
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7 comments:
You are not a freak.
You are not off base.
You are a mom who wants what's most appropriate for her children and to teach them the ways of the world in their own time.
You are also a mom who has five other children to be concerned with and doesn't have time to weed through all of the preparatory nonsense that seems to be a big part of the curriculum (you're right, that should be done for you if you paid so much for it).
Some people get very protective about their chosen curriculum (to the point of craziness, IMO) and they will defend it with their "blinders" on, thinking that it could not possibly do them wrong (which is why you're getting "flamed"). I would talk with a rep from the company about all of your concerns and ask for a refund.
That BS about "they're going to learn it anyway" is a key indicator of the ignorance involved here. Of COURSE they're going to learn about the evil, bad things of the world. We, as their parents have been given charge to protect and prepare them and if we believe that protection means to wait to introduce certain concepts, then that's how it's going to be. Period.
It's our right, damnit.
Don't let them make you think you're crazy!
I use Seton but I pick and choose from them. There's nothing wrong with that. I've never gotten any pressure from them to do the whole program. I am not "public school at home" (that would be HORRIBLE and so beside the point!).
Good luck with the curriculum nazis!
Gosh, Kelly, I'm sorry you're having such trouble! I feel bad as I was one of the ones who recommended Sonlight. It worked for us, but it doesn't work for everyone. I do believe they have a 6 month gaurantee - you can return it all and get most, if not all, of your money back, I believe.
I don't think you have to pre-read all the books - IMO, that's one of the beauties of the program. I know you don't like the IG and have put it away - but do take another look. I never used the IG as written, but it was invaluable to me as a reference tool. They have extensive notes on all the books they recommend. I always found references to, "this scene on pg 6 is a bit intense and you may want to skip these 6 lines - it doesn't impact the main story at all". If they don't have stuff like that in your IG, then the program has definitely changed since I last purchased from them (2 years ago).
They have always had some controversial books, and they have always been very open about that. They believe that discussion of more mature topics (ie, the violence associated with war) is better than keeping your kids sheltered (not that I'm saying that's what you're doing, just explaining *their* reasonings). They want to make sure kids run across violence and swear words and anti-Christian sentiment in the comfort of your home, your couch, in your arms. That way they are prepared and know how to deal with it and critique it when they come across it on their own. They never put a controversial book in the readers (the ones kids read on their own) with the younger set - but they did have some controversial books in the read-a-louds even for the younger kids - figuring that you would be reading with the kids, you can self-edit a word or a few lines on the fly if you feel you must, and the whole point of the read-a-louds is to discuss them with your kids anyway. So, if you don't like how the character behaves in a book like "Cheaper by the Dozen", then you can talk to your kids about the why of it, or if the war scenes are incredibly violent, you can edit that out, or talk to your kids about how war really is hell. Kwim? I think it's perfectly appropriate for some kids to hear/read that sort of thing at 9, but definitely *not* appropriate for other 9 year olds - it really depends on the child, and as the parent, it's up to you to decide that.
Also, Sonlight is notorious for their levels being WAY higher than actual grade levels. Most people I know recommend starting a level or two, or even three, below what grade level your child is. I know - makes no sense, I have no idea why they don't change it, but all the message boards and the SL website itself is very open about going down a level rather than up. Primarily because of the whole maturity issue. Many 9 year olds *aren't* ready for the more mature themes of war and violence found in the Core 3/4 level.
Anyway - I think it is perfectly appropriate to edit on the fly as you read some of these more questionable scenes. The pages on all the book found in the IG should help you figure out where you might need to do that in advance. And they also should give extensive notes in the pages about the readers (the ones your child reads on their own) so you don't have to pre-read *everything*. At least they did in the IGs I purchased. Finally, if you're really unsatisfied, there should be the opportunity to return the program and get your money back. Also, there should be a way you can call up SL customer service and switch to the Core 1/2 level. That is a lot less controversial than the 3/4 levels. And it's a great program - don't think that it's at a "First Grade" level, cuz it's not! Anyway - there should be a way to either get your money back or switch levels if you're really unhappy. Again - there was 2 years ago, I'm not positive about now, but definitely check on that!
I'm really sorry that you don't like Sonlight - I know you had hoped it would make your life a lot *less* stressful, not more. I'm sorry that I recommended something that you're so unhappy with! :-(
From a slightly different perspective. Although I agree that just because they make it part of the curriculum doesn't mean you have to use it, or SHOULD use it if you feel your child isn't ready, some books with questionable aspects can be great "teachable moments". It sounds like that's exactly what you have in "Cheaper...." You could use it as an opportunity to discuss the father's prejudices and the daughters' disobedience and how you feel about those things. I know you like "Harry Potter," and many people have the same objections about those books because of his disobedience. Perhaps you could use it as a way to discuss the similarities and differences of the teenagers and why you feel one is "okay" but the other not.
As for "Hannalee," I think you have to look at your daughter's maturity to make that decision. Will she be horrified when she reads it? My oldest has read the book for another language arts program (so it's not just Sonlight recommending it), and the most I got out of her was a "gross" when it came to the battle scene, and I don't think she understood what was really going on the the "rape" scene. Until she asks, we'll just move on through it without comment. But I know another mother who says her daughter is very sensitive and that that kind of thing would send her into a depression for days, so she won't read it. You know your child and what will disturb her. Make that the basis of whether you choose to read it. I don't want my child to know things now just because she will eventually, but I don't want her to miss out on great stories and teachable moments if she's emotionally ready for them, either.
As for Sonlight's usability, although I haven't received mine yet, I did take a look at their videos and found them helpful. Especially the last one where it talks about and shows you how you can customize the IG to make it as friendly as you need it to be. In fact, I've been mulling over how I'm going to organize it so it can be mom and kid friendly. But calling customer service is a good idea. They might be able to give you some helpful hints to make it easier. They've been pretty responsive and helpful when I've called.
Good luck and God bless!
I think it does seem strange that they would include those books.
Maybe kids are going to learn about it any way but they should learn that it's bad and wrong so I think it's totally wrong to present them in this light. As if it's educational or something.
I think it's totally okay to pick and choose. Do what you know is best.
No, to your main questions. You aren't being naive; one of the many reasons we are looking to h/s is so that we *do* have control over what our kids learn and when (and I would venture to say a lot of h/s parents would agree with this). That's exactly what you're doing -- making sound decisions for your children. No one has to agree those decisions; that's the beauty of homeschool.
As for Sonlight, I've found these posts about the curriculum pretty handy, because it was my top choice while planning where to start with our oldest. I'm feeling pretty glad I haven't shelled out the money yet. Thanks!
Jen- please don't feel in any way responsible!!! I bought Sonlight after literally MONTHS of poring over their catalog and their website and talking to everyone I could find. LOL! [How I make most decisions I guess LOL!]. It is in NO WAY your fault if I love it or hate it - you gave honest experience and I appreciate it!
I still love the idea, but after much thinking on this today, I think I am returning the Core 3/4. I am keeping Core 1/2 that I had for the younger kids and I will do something else with my oldest. I won't purchase Sonlight again.
Someone recommended Angelicum's book list to me today, so I'm going to check that out for my oldest.
Kristin - when it comes to the Instructor Guides, I feel honestly that Sonlight is downright dishonest about them. They sell them as something that will make life "really easy" and the teacher doesn't have to worry about. They never mention anywhere in their propaganda that you will need to watch a video just to learn how to put the thing together and that you may have to make multiple calls just to understand how to use it - or that you will need to spend 10-20 hours per core learning how to use the Instructor Guide [which is what they tell you when they *send* the Guides to you after you pay]. Personally, knowing how much we have going on in these coming months, I *never* would have purchased this program if Sonlight had been honest about the amount of work involved in just getting "ramped up" to begin teaching their stuff.
I think that's my biggest frustration here - I think that Sonlight has been a bit deceptive in their marketing and it has cost me a boatload of time and stress. :(
Heather, I'm glad you are finding my experience helpful. Obviously Sonlight DOES work for a whole bunch of people, but I have found it to be a nightmare. Definitely not the "easy" curriculum it is advertised to be.
Seton IS that type of curriculum, and I appreciate the ease with which I can teach their program! I *need* that kind of program LOL!
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